I am sure many of you have heard of this story in the news recently. Pictures of people dressed as if from a different era, looking more suited to be from the time period of the Primrose Girls rather than modern day. I'd like to take a minute to go over it briefly and share my thoughts. I want to make it clear though that I am far from an expert on this news story. I have only read over some of the media coverage on the internet. So take everything I say here with a grain of salt. First off, a quote from msnbc which sums up what has happened.
"ELDORADO, Texas - Officials on Monday announced that 534 women and children — more than twice as many as had been earlier reported — were removed from a polygamist compound and that all 401 children have been placed in state custody because a judge deemed them in imminent danger of physical abuse."
"The dayslong raid on the sprawling compound built by the now-jailed Jeffs was sparked by a 16-year-old girl's call to authorities that she was being abused and that girls as young as 14 and 15 were being forced into marriages with much older men."
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23993440/
It is easy to follow news coverage like this and see it in a one sided manner. They paint of a picture of beating, abuse, rape, and forced marriages for young girls and women. It is made to seem like some kind of molester paradise or hell on earth. Is it really like that though?"The dayslong raid on the sprawling compound built by the now-jailed Jeffs was sparked by a 16-year-old girl's call to authorities that she was being abused and that girls as young as 14 and 15 were being forced into marriages with much older men."
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23993440/
Let's take a minute to examine the facts from the start with our skepticism turned up high. A 16 year old calls saying she is abused physically and sexually, basically saying she has been beaten and raped. Who knows exactly what she said over the phone at this point, we only know what we have been told second hand. When someone says "beaten" it usually brings up images of terrible abuse involving broken bones and bleeding. Is that really what it means in this context?
I will quote now from a book called "Escape" co-authored by Carolyn Jessop, a woman who was born into a FLDS community. She has been on the news lately.
"In private, my mother was depressed and volatile. She beat us almost every day. The range was anything from several small swats on the behind to a lengthy whipping with a belt."
http://www.diesel-ebooks.com/cgi-bin/chapter.pl?isbn=9780767927567
So basically several small swats on the behind is considered beating. Even if we are talking about a belt whipping I'm sure most reading this would agree that a 16 year old girl getting the belt is hardly a news story. Putting the beating aside, what about the rape? When you hear the word rape you think about a girl being held down and violated while struggling to get away. Of course there is another kind of rape. The kind called statutory rape, where even if the girl was totally consenting, the male would be sent to prison. Which kind of rape is it then?http://www.diesel-ebooks.com/cgi-bin/chapter.pl?isbn=9780767927567
The goal of this community is obviously to marry off girls as young as possible in order to start birthing children. The entire concept of polygamy facilitates that goal. Kind of like having one rooster in a hen house. Is this wrong? I honestly don't know. What I do know is that it is a very "American" idea to break off and seek freedom from religious persecution. Why should the government involve itself in family matters? If one or two girls call about abuse should they send in swat teams to extract over 500 women and children from the community in response? We may not agree with their values, but it is still sad to see their way of life being attacked so viciously.
The most interesting part of this is the media's response to the allegations of abuse. They call it "beating" over and over but never say what that actually entails. I wonder if they purposely shy away from saying spanking because they are afraid some people might agree with it as a disciplinary tool. Even if they did mention spanking children, would they ever mention wife spanking? No, I think not. It would always be referred to as beating or abuse. What does everyone else think about this and the news story? Please feel free to comment here even if you totally disagree with what I've said. Hate mail would be welcome too. I am surprised I haven't gotten any of that yet over some of the posts in this blog.
8 comments:
Polygamy is illegal-follow the law like everyone else has to, too bad if you don't like it then move elsewhere. And rape is far more than as you have stated, but 50 year old men and 16 year old girls? More than disgusting.
I might suggest the middle east, abuse of women is mighty popular there. Seems like they could probably live freely and do as they wish there, the men that is. I mean a special 14-year-old mail order bride prime for birthing may be nice when you're a middle aged man...yummm. ;-)
A marriage between a 16 year old girl and a 50 year old man is definitely not an appealing concept, however under Texas law it is legal with the approval of the girl's parents. The age of consent in Texas is 17, but it doesn't apply between husband and wife. However a girl that is younger than 16 cannot marry, even with parental approval. Also the marriage would never have really been valid because you can't marry more than one person. I know that at least in one case the rape was more than statutory, but how can you so easily condemn hundreds of people as rapists over the actions of just one or two that we have heard of? Your comparison between this lifestyle and that of people in the middle east is interesting. I tend to think that we mostly hear the horror stories from there and think them to be the norm. We also have to assume that there are many women in this west Texas community who are happy to live there. I do mostly agree with your opinion though. Thanks for the comments! :)
Texas should be nuked. No offense.
I'm totally kidding by the way, i think your opinions are crazy and backwards, and i hate almost all of them, but wicked awesome just the same keep on keepin' on! :)
Ok, so time for a different opinion..... Why on earth is polygamy against the law anyway? As far as I can tell, it's because some person in the government thought that it was "immoral" and "wrong", so they got a lot of other people to pass a law against it. Who are they to judge anyway? For FLDS groups it appears to be a religious choice, and since we're SUPPOSED to have freedom of religion in this country the government should butt the hell out.
There should absolutely be a way out for those that are born to such a community that don't want to stay. But if a woman chooses this way of life, then it should be her decision. To take away such rights is tantamount to returning to the days when abortion was not legal.
So go ahead and deal with the few who take advantage of the polygamist lifestyle. The rest of the community should be left alone so long as they are able to support themselves and their children without government support.
Hi Sir. I think the DCPS went way to far in ho they reacted to the phone call the y got. So far they traced the phone call to Colorado from a woman who complained before about these people. If a girl was in danger, they could of taken her into custody or asked for other families to babysit her until they could find out the truth rather than yank over 400 kids from their families , even babies. This country was founded on freedom from religion persecution a little about 7 generations ago. It was just about 100 years ago that girls and boy married at age 12 or 14 in this country cause we only lived to age 50. Also they dress like that in the colonial days and on the TV show "Little House on the Prairie" but that is not reason to take kids away from their parents. they even took babies and boys too. One girl was 22 yrs old but because without makeup and her long hair they didn't believe she was that old until her birth certificate was shown but she was not let go even then. I bet she didn't look 16 either but the officials were to hard headed to say they did wrong. Ace you know me and I'd be so scared at my age if I got sent to some strange place with a family I didn't know to live with. Plus when the kids got taken away, the state had doctors and other social workers take pictures of them naked and examine them which to me is abuse by the officials. I get embarrassed going to see my own doctor so I can imagine how scared the young girls and boys were being in a room naked with lots of people poking and staring at them naked. Look at the long dresses the girls wear, so that tells me they are taught to be modest and cover up their bodies. I bet no one wears thongs and short skirts either like in our society. Girls I see at the mall look like tramps, the girls taken away look normal to me and how respectful girls should dress. Plus they are taught how important family, God and having faith is. These kids will be traumatized not from abuse but from what the state did to them. It's awful and the state of Texas should fired the people who ordered that this happen. I'm religious too and what I believe its between our parents, God and the church. Just cause the kids are home schooled and keep to themselves and believe different things than us is no reason to take them away from their loving parents. God teaches us to accept people who are different from us. In my church we keep to ourselves too just for this reason. So should I be taken away from my parents and people who love me cause I don't act slutty and accept that my parents have the right to discipline me? I'm to young to know about polygamy but our Pastor has been discussing this with our youth group & church elders and he said many men in our country cheat on their wifes with other women. Is that not a form of polygamy? In 'our normal society' don't we have crime & child molesters too? Don't we have kids who die from being beaten by a parent or worse, a boyfriend living in sin with the mother? This religious community was raided for their beliefs and cause they're different than other people. That's no right to do what they did and hurt & harm the kids they thought they were protecting. They acted to fast and ignored the evidence! Oh by the way, I checked on age of consent in Connecticut - its 16 and in Maine - its 14 yr old. Should we raid any families who got married that young? We have the highest rate of teen pregnancies ever in big cities according to state officials. I read some girls are having sex at 10 yrs old. Why aren't we investigating who's having sex with those girls? Why aren't the schools & parents teaching girls and boys to abstain from having sex? Should these parents all be arrested too? I took a vow to be a virgin until marriage as a gift to the man I marry. I guess my faith is just like those in Texas teaching values plus right from wrong to the 400+ kids we threw into foster care. Bethany [age 17]
Oh 1 more thing. These families have a lot of children, they looked well fed, groomed and well mannered, not abused. Should the state of Texas put a limit of how many kids they can have? That'll probably be the next thing the state will make them do in order to get their kids back to them. Any person in their right mind could see by looking at these kids who they are not abused. Compare that to all the other kids you know who live near you or you've seen at the mall. Who looks more abused, kids out at late hours getting into trouble or kids who have to be in bed early after their prayers get said? Tanya said it right - our government needs to worry about important things in our society. Kids get out of public high school read and write at 7 grade levels; they have sex at young ages and have no respect for anyone including their parents and police. I know if you compared the kids taken from their families in Texas to 'normal kids in our society'; they Texas kids would stand far above the 'normal kids'. So who's doing a better job raising their kids?? Oh by the way, I for got ot mention before that molesters in our society are usually much older [adults] and know the child; many times are relatives! Who's checking on them? Bethany
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